What are the consequences of "AGS Fault Time"?

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JJG
Forum Member
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2020 4:57 am
My RE system: Inverter: Outback VFX3024E
Charger controller: Outback FlexMax 80A
Communication: MATE2
Batt: 800Ah C5 24V
Panels: 6x275w + 6x165w
Location: Lleida, Catalonia.

What are the consequences of "AGS Fault Time"?

Post by JJG » Tue Feb 04, 2020 2:24 am

Hi!
I would use the ags control for contactor control with the FX aux at 12V output. This contactor does not power the ca-in, so VFX will not detect any current and display an error. See page 78 of the MATE user manual:

AGS Fault Time is the period the generator is given to connect to the FX system after the AUX output has been activated. If the generator fails to connect and provide AC current, the MATE displays an AGS error. The user can set this time anywhere from 5-30 minutes by pressing the <INC> and <DEC> soft keys. Press the <DOWN> soft key to reach the cool down time screen.


But I have doubts about the reaction "AGS Fault Time". Can this function be overridden? Does this error disable AUX control? :-k

Regards!!!

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Kurt Lundquist
Alpha Energy Engineering
Posts: 1447
Joined: Tue May 31, 2011 7:23 am
My RE system: VFX3524, Mate3, 200Ah 24V AGM Battery Bank
Location: Arlington, WA

Re: What are the consequences of "AGS Fault Time"?

Post by Kurt Lundquist » Tue Feb 04, 2020 7:32 am

The Mate stops trying to start the generator by shutting off the AGS AUX port. The Mate will not try to start the generator again until the error is cleared. You have to set AGS to Manual Off then back to Auto or power cycle the Mate to reset the error.

What is your goal? Maybe there is an alternate function that we could suggest.

Thanks,

-Kurt
Kurt Lundquist
Renewable Energy Project Engineer
http://alphaenergy.us/

JJG
Forum Member
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2020 4:57 am
My RE system: Inverter: Outback VFX3024E
Charger controller: Outback FlexMax 80A
Communication: MATE2
Batt: 800Ah C5 24V
Panels: 6x275w + 6x165w
Location: Lleida, Catalonia.

Re: What are the consequences of "AGS Fault Time"?

Post by JJG » Tue Feb 04, 2020 2:47 pm

Hello!

Yes ... I have already checked the ags fault action...

My goal is use a 4P contactor (2NO + 2NC with 12v coil controlled by VFX aux) to switch from PV to Grid with the AGS parameter: low voltage, demand load, must run... but without powering the AC-in.

The contactor configuration is Grid in 2NO and FV in 2NC (if coil is not energized use FV, but energized use Grid).

I initially wanted to use the Mate's HBX feature but you advised me not to... in EU, the ac-in is only for ac-generator, not for grid... :-k Did I understand correctly?

Thx.

Kurt Lundquist wrote:
Tue Feb 04, 2020 7:32 am
The Mate stops trying to start the generator by shutting off the AGS AUX port. The Mate will not try to start the generator again until the error is cleared. You have to set AGS to Manual Off then back to Auto or power cycle the Mate to reset the error.

What is your goal? Maybe there is an alternate function that we could suggest.

Thanks,

-Kurt

User avatar
Kurt Lundquist
Alpha Energy Engineering
Posts: 1447
Joined: Tue May 31, 2011 7:23 am
My RE system: VFX3524, Mate3, 200Ah 24V AGM Battery Bank
Location: Arlington, WA

Re: What are the consequences of "AGS Fault Time"?

Post by Kurt Lundquist » Wed Feb 05, 2020 8:05 am

JJG wrote:
Tue Feb 04, 2020 2:47 pm
I initially wanted to use the Mate's HBX feature but you advised me not to... in EU, the ac-in is only for ac-generator, not for grid... Did I understand correctly?
The inverter isn't listed for being connected to the grid. That is the only reason why the manual says generator only. If your local inspector/regulations are ok with it there is no reason why the inverter cannot be connected to the grid. In that case I would use HBX. Otherwise, the "Gen Alert" AUX function on the FX inverter is probably a better choice than AGS to power your transfer. You have to fully break the output before transferring to the grid or transferring back to the inverter. Are you ok with your loads shutting down randomly when this happens?

-Kurt
Kurt Lundquist
Renewable Energy Project Engineer
http://alphaenergy.us/

JJG
Forum Member
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2020 4:57 am
My RE system: Inverter: Outback VFX3024E
Charger controller: Outback FlexMax 80A
Communication: MATE2
Batt: 800Ah C5 24V
Panels: 6x275w + 6x165w
Location: Lleida, Catalonia.

Re: What are the consequences of "AGS Fault Time"?

Post by JJG » Wed Feb 05, 2020 3:04 pm

Kurt Lundquist wrote:
Wed Feb 05, 2020 8:05 am
The inverter isn't listed for being connected to the grid. That is the only reason why the manual says generator only. If your local inspector/regulations are ok with it there is no reason why the inverter cannot be connected to the grid. In that case I would use HBX. Otherwise, the "Gen Alert" AUX function on the FX inverter is probably a better choice than AGS to power your transfer.
The "Gen Alert" Aux function is only for battery voltage? Or also by load demand? My vfx is only 3kva and grid is 3,45kva (máx 5,5kva for 10 minutes)

The technical regulation only says that power cannot be injected into the grid. "zero grid". Except approved inverters, "grid-tie" or "on-grid".
Kurt Lundquist wrote:
Wed Feb 05, 2020 8:05 am
You have to fully break the output before transferring to the grid or transferring back to the inverter. Are you ok with your loads shutting down randomly when this happens?
Nothing happens, it is a house. With the contactor, the power outage is 10 milliseconds.

Is it fully proven that no electricity comes out of ac-in?

Thanks Kurt

User avatar
Kurt Lundquist
Alpha Energy Engineering
Posts: 1447
Joined: Tue May 31, 2011 7:23 am
My RE system: VFX3524, Mate3, 200Ah 24V AGM Battery Bank
Location: Arlington, WA

Re: What are the consequences of "AGS Fault Time"?

Post by Kurt Lundquist » Thu Feb 06, 2020 7:31 am

JJG wrote:
Wed Feb 05, 2020 3:04 pm
The "Gen Alert" Aux function is only for battery voltage? Or also by load demand? My vfx is only 3kva and grid is 3,45kva (máx 5,5kva for 10 minutes)
Gen Alert is for battery voltage only. I did not think that you were also considering the load start feature of AGS. Switching under heavy load will be hard on the contactors.
JJG wrote:
Wed Feb 05, 2020 3:04 pm
Is it fully proven that no electricity comes out of ac-in?
The VFX3024E inverter does not have the firmware to push power out the AC input. OutBack inverters that can "Sell" power to the grid have a "G" or an "R" in the model name (other than the Skybox Inverter).

-Kurt
Kurt Lundquist
Renewable Energy Project Engineer
http://alphaenergy.us/

JJG
Forum Member
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Jan 08, 2020 4:57 am
My RE system: Inverter: Outback VFX3024E
Charger controller: Outback FlexMax 80A
Communication: MATE2
Batt: 800Ah C5 24V
Panels: 6x275w + 6x165w
Location: Lleida, Catalonia.

Re: What are the consequences of "AGS Fault Time"?

Post by JJG » Thu Feb 06, 2020 2:02 pm

Finally I have decided to use hbx option, I think it is the best option even if it is not approved by the EU... :roll: It is only to amortize the existing installation, in the future I will install inverter on-grid...

Manny thanks, Kurt =D>

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