generator set up vxfr3648a

Discussion about the OutBack Energy Cell Batteries
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Sasxha189
Forum Member
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:44 am
My RE system: Surrette rolls 48v nominal bank built from "s-550" (6FS L16-HC) 6 volt batteries 2 strings of 8
Outback power flexmax 80 and 60 chargers
Outback power VFXR3648a inverter
7kw of sunpower panels. 10 x21 (345w) and 10 x22 (360w)

generator set up vxfr3648a

Post by Sasxha189 » Fri Jun 21, 2019 10:06 am

Hello. I'm a relative amateur to solar installation, but I am building a system for a client. I have built before for myself, so I get the basics. The question is as follows: I have a vfxr3648 outback inverter I want to charge my 48 v battery bank (2 strings of 8 rolls s-550 6 volt batteries) with a generator as needed. I do not have mate and I am not using ags. I have searched through the manual and I cannot find any specific information about the install. After reading a few posts here I gathered that I could directly wire my generator to the AC in lugs on my inverter. I have done so, but I am not sure when to disconnect the generator from the system. The process is as follows: turn on generator, (3500w 25 a predator) plug in power cord, watch the charge controller until the "out" reading reaches 53.0V, (it seems to stop accumulation here) unplug power cord, power down generator. Is there anything wrong here? The system is not under load whatsoever, but my voltage out reading drops relatively quick. Everything is wired up except the panels and the AC breaker box. (I guess this turned into two questions)

Thank you for your time!
Sasxha

Mike Curran
Forum Emperor
Posts: 1111
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 6:28 pm
My RE system: Outback:
- 8 (2x4) Evergreen 180's into one MX60 (2007)
- 6 (2×3) ALEO S79-300's into one FM80 (2017)
- 2 grid-tied GVFX3524's classic stacked for 120/240VAC (2007)
- 12 Surrette/Rolls 2V x 1766Ah (2007)
- Hub10.3, Mate3s, FNDC, RTS, OpticsRE. Tigo Energy ES maximizers on each PV module.

Westinghouse Solar: (2012)
- 30 (2x15) 235W panels with Enphase M215 microinverters, grid-tied.

All self-designed and self-installed
Location: Chagrin Falls, Ohio

Re: generator set up vxfr3648a

Post by Mike Curran » Sat Jun 29, 2019 6:31 am

If you're running the generator to charge the battery when there's been a lack of PV, you need to let your system go through an absorb cycle (until batteries' specific gravities are in the 1.265 range) before shutting down the generator. Without having a Mate (and better yet, a Mate and a FlexnetDC) in this system, programming the charge parameters into the VFXR so that this process is easy to set up and monitor presents a problem. You can watch the voltages on the charge controllers but you won't be able to see how many charging amps the inverter is supplying from the generator, or set the absorb time other than the default setting in the VFXR, which may or may not be best for this system's battery.

Maybe another user without a Mate has an idea...
http://www.tigoenergy.com/site.php?95b2dca2-ca6c
https://enlighten.enphaseenergy.com/public/systems/Hctc107221

Sasxha189
Forum Member
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:44 am
My RE system: Surrette rolls 48v nominal bank built from "s-550" (6FS L16-HC) 6 volt batteries 2 strings of 8
Outback power flexmax 80 and 60 chargers
Outback power VFXR3648a inverter
7kw of sunpower panels. 10 x21 (345w) and 10 x22 (360w)

Re: generator set up vxfr3648a

Post by Sasxha189 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 9:23 am

This was a great response. Thank k you

SandyP
Forum Guru
Posts: 314
Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:44 am
My RE system: 8 x 190W 24V Suntech panels (4 strings of 2)
4 x 325W 24V Suntech panels (2 strings of 2) added Sept2018
Mate2
Outback FM60 MPPT (max output lowered to 55amps)
12 x 2V Hoppecke GEL 660 Ah C100 - 24V System
Outback VFX3024 Inverter/Charger
Victron BMV-602s
Honda 5.5kW Genset
Location: Victoria, Australia

Re: generator set up vxfr3648a

Post by SandyP » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:01 pm

Given there has already been a lot of money invested in this I suggest, at a minimum, you get a Mate2 ($220-250 online) so you can set up the system properly and see what the inverter/charger is doing.
Once you stop battery charging the voltage will drop as the inverter will have a 25W load on the batteries.
The only way you currently have to see how your batteries are being charged (and their SoC) is to take SG readings.

Sasxha189
Forum Member
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:44 am
My RE system: Surrette rolls 48v nominal bank built from "s-550" (6FS L16-HC) 6 volt batteries 2 strings of 8
Outback power flexmax 80 and 60 chargers
Outback power VFXR3648a inverter
7kw of sunpower panels. 10 x21 (345w) and 10 x22 (360w)

Re: generator set up vxfr3648a

Post by Sasxha189 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:06 pm

Ifn you'd could front me the cash...

Sasxha189
Forum Member
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:44 am
My RE system: Surrette rolls 48v nominal bank built from "s-550" (6FS L16-HC) 6 volt batteries 2 strings of 8
Outback power flexmax 80 and 60 chargers
Outback power VFXR3648a inverter
7kw of sunpower panels. 10 x21 (345w) and 10 x22 (360w)

Re: generator set up vxfr3648a

Post by Sasxha189 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:09 pm

I spoke with an outback rep who basically said you can't know when. They're fully charged w/o mate and that there is a slim chance that if the inverter messes up it could damage the batteries/inverter but the inverter is built to protect itself

SandyP
Forum Guru
Posts: 314
Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2011 4:44 am
My RE system: 8 x 190W 24V Suntech panels (4 strings of 2)
4 x 325W 24V Suntech panels (2 strings of 2) added Sept2018
Mate2
Outback FM60 MPPT (max output lowered to 55amps)
12 x 2V Hoppecke GEL 660 Ah C100 - 24V System
Outback VFX3024 Inverter/Charger
Victron BMV-602s
Honda 5.5kW Genset
Location: Victoria, Australia

Re: generator set up vxfr3648a

Post by SandyP » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:20 pm

Sasxha189 wrote:Ifn you'd could front me the cash...
Maybe see if you can borrow one then?

Pity the Outback rep did not tell you that the only real way of telling the state of charge of a FLA battery is by its electrolyte SG - read some of the topics on this in the Outback forums.

Sasxha189
Forum Member
Posts: 8
Joined: Fri Jun 21, 2019 9:44 am
My RE system: Surrette rolls 48v nominal bank built from "s-550" (6FS L16-HC) 6 volt batteries 2 strings of 8
Outback power flexmax 80 and 60 chargers
Outback power VFXR3648a inverter
7kw of sunpower panels. 10 x21 (345w) and 10 x22 (360w)

Re: generator set up vxfr3648a

Post by Sasxha189 » Sat Jun 29, 2019 8:32 pm

I'm aware, also the person who commented before you also made that clear. Thankss for your concern

raysun
Forum Czar
Posts: 755
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower One: FX3048T, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
Outback 200NC batteries (8 @ 48v)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
Suniva 330 watt panels (12 - 6 Strings @ 2 Series)
Hyundai 355 watt panels (6 - 3 strings @ 2 series)

Re: generator set up vxfr3648a

Post by raysun » Sat Jun 29, 2019 10:38 pm

I'm going to pile on here. Please don't be offended.

Having invested as much as has been in the system, and with the expectation, I'd assume, that it will deliver a high level of power and reliability, it is only sensible to make the final investment in the system components designed expressly to monitor and control the system effectively.

Driving this system without a Mate3s and FNDC is a bit like driving a Ferrari without a steering wheel.

Don't turn the ignition key without one.

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