Adding FlexNet with Simpliphi battery system

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Onfoot
Forum Guru
Posts: 145
Joined: Tue Dec 21, 2010 9:48 pm
My RE system: 2 FX 3048T inverters in parallel.
1 Flexmax60 and 1 Flexmax80 Charge Controllers for solar array.
1 Midnite Solar 4000 Watt AC clipper for wind turbine
1 Midnite Solar Classic 250 Charge Controller for wind turbine
1 Hub 10.3,
1 Mate3s
1 FLEXnet DC
8 Simpliphi 3.5kW LiFePo batteries
18 Helio 255W solar panels on 3 racks--4590W feeding Flexmax 80
12 250 LG solar panels on 2 racks--3000W feeding Flexmax 60
2.5kW Proven Wind Turbine on 90' Tower feeding Midnite Sun clipper and Classic 250 charge controller
6kW, Single phase Newage Stamford generator on Kubota 905 Diesel
Location: Whitehorse, Yukon, Canada

Adding FlexNet with Simpliphi battery system

Post by Onfoot » Tue Jan 22, 2019 7:57 pm

I am in the process of swapping out my 16 year old Surrette batteries with Simpliphi LiFePo batteries.

Outback folks said that I need to add a FlexNet to insure that all parameters for the LiFePo batteries are managed. (My old FX inverters might not, they say, be up to the challenge. Or so I understand from OB.

So... I have one shunt in my box, with batteries on one side and everything else (two FM CCs and my wind turbine CC) on the other side of the shunt. There is an old Trace monitor that has been able to reveal amps in and out. All has worked well up to now.

My question: Do I need to be concerned that I have only one shunt? I note the the FLEXnet is able to connect with up to three shunts.

Welcome advice. For the record, the LiFePo batteries are touchy about keeping charge within acceptable limits. That is the only reason for the FLEXnet being added to the system.

FYI, I will be adding a Midnite Solar CC with their Clipper box to manage input from my wind turbine. OB does not have anything to do with wind, and Simpliphi recommends the Midnite Sun CC and Clipper. I was presuming to have it connect to the shunt as does the current turbine CC (which is not able to adjust to LiFePo battery needs).

Again, thoughts? Advice?

Thank you!

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Gwendoly Espe
Applications Engineering
Posts: 180
Joined: Wed Feb 22, 2017 11:04 am

Re: Adding FlexNet with Simpliphi battery system

Post by Gwendoly Espe » Wed Jan 23, 2019 9:03 am

Hello,


From the application note :http://www.outbackpower.com/downloads/d ... p_note.pdf

it doesn't look like that the note doesn't say that the FNDC isn't 100% necessary. It's highly advised due to the Low Battery Cut-out delay of 5 min from the inverter. With Lithuim Ion batteries, if there is a large enough load at a lower SoC, the voltage can drop off faster than this delay. With the FNDC and the AUX on it, it can cutout the batteries much faster in situations like these. Below is the exact excerpt:

For fast discharge applications that donÔÇÖt have the
extended LBCO range, or where even the extended
LBCO range is not enough due to the five minute
delay, there is another solution. The FN-DC relay
can be used to detect the voltage drop-off with little
or no delay. The relay contacts can then be
connected to the INVERTER ON/OFF terminals to turn
the inverter off and prevent the batteries from being
completely discharged.
I hope this helps a little with the FNDC side of your question. Others may have opinions especially with the other option you mentioned.
Gwendoly Espe
Applications Engineer


Alpha Technologies Inc. / OutBack Power Technologies
3767 Alpha Way Bellingham WA 98226 USA
http://www.alpha.com

Mike Curran
Forum Emperor
Posts: 1089
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2004 6:28 pm
My RE system: Outback:
- 8 (2x4) Evergreen 180's into one MX60 (2007)
- 6 (2×3) ALEO S79-300's into one FM80 (2017)
- 2 grid-tied GVFX3524's classic stacked for 120/240VAC (2007)
- 12 Surrette/Rolls 2V x 1766Ah (2007)
- Hub10.3, Mate3s, FNDC, RTS, OpticsRE. Tigo Energy ES maximizers on each PV module.

Westinghouse Solar: (2012)
- 30 (2x15) 235W panels with Enphase M215 microinverters, grid-tied.

All self-designed and self-installed
Location: Chagrin Falls, Ohio

Re: Adding FlexNet with Simpliphi battery system

Post by Mike Curran » Wed Jan 23, 2019 10:55 am

Hi - I have 2 shunts in my system, one for current to/from the battery from my FX's and the other for current to the battery from my charge controllers (MX60 & FM80). I could've hooked them all into one shunt like you but wanted to have a separate indication of charging amps from my solar panels, so I added the second shunt for that. If I were you, I'd add 2 shunts, one add'l for your solar and the 2nd add'l for your wind turbine. As long as you have the FNDC's capabilities to handle 3 shunts, it's not too much add'l expense for a great improvement in monitoring capability. Of course maybe you already have what you need in your Trace monitor...

Long story short, I don't think you need to be concerned about having just one shunt. Your system will work fine without but they do add some good info.

My 2 cents' worth, maybe others will give their input. - Mike

Edit: Good to see your Rolls battery lasted so long. I'll be going your route one of these days, let us know how it all works out.
http://www.tigoenergy.com/site.php?95b2dca2-ca6c
https://enlighten.enphaseenergy.com/public/systems/Hctc107221

Onfoot
Forum Guru
Posts: 145
Joined: Tue Dec 21, 2010 9:48 pm
My RE system: 2 FX 3048T inverters in parallel.
1 Flexmax60 and 1 Flexmax80 Charge Controllers for solar array.
1 Midnite Solar 4000 Watt AC clipper for wind turbine
1 Midnite Solar Classic 250 Charge Controller for wind turbine
1 Hub 10.3,
1 Mate3s
1 FLEXnet DC
8 Simpliphi 3.5kW LiFePo batteries
18 Helio 255W solar panels on 3 racks--4590W feeding Flexmax 80
12 250 LG solar panels on 2 racks--3000W feeding Flexmax 60
2.5kW Proven Wind Turbine on 90' Tower feeding Midnite Sun clipper and Classic 250 charge controller
6kW, Single phase Newage Stamford generator on Kubota 905 Diesel
Location: Whitehorse, Yukon, Canada

Re: Adding FlexNet with Simpliphi battery system

Post by Onfoot » Sat Jan 26, 2019 10:22 am

Thank you, Gwendoly and Mike. Much appreciate your input. Today I will install the DCFLEXnet--still with the old batteries. Want to make sure everything is working around the batteries before doing the battery swap.

Mauricio
Forum Expert
Posts: 73
Joined: Fri Apr 16, 2010 2:49 pm
My RE system: 24 LG275, 275W panels, 2 FlexWare500, four VFX3648, series/parallel Quad system, two FlexMax80, X240 transformer, MATE3, FN-DC, 6 SimpliPhi 48V 3.5kWh Lithium Ferro Phosphate (LFP) batteries, Cummins Onan 20GGMA generator (20 kW, LP Vapor fueled), OpticsRe.
Note: 12 Surrette Rolls 4Ks25P Batteries ( 4V, 1350 AmpHr), were replaced by the 6 LFP on June 21/19.
Location: Todos Santos, Baja California Sur, Mexico
Contact:

Re: Adding FlexNet with Simpliphi battery system

Post by Mauricio » Sat Jul 13, 2019 11:11 am

Hello Onfoot, just saw your January posting. Did you do the switch to LiFePo? I just switched from Rolls to SimpliPhi myself and did a posting on the Off-Grid section about it and was interested in finding other Outback users that also did a similar switch and get their take/experience on it.
Thank you, Mauricio
Mauricio - Todos Santos, BCS
http://www.arribadelaroca.com

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