Bypassing Solar

Discussion about OutBack Inverters in Grid Tie Applications

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kr8009
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My RE system: System installed around 2007

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FX series Inverter / Charger (x4)
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Bypassing Solar

Post by kr8009 » Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:42 am

I have an older system.

A couple days ago it stopped working. Mate was blinking on and off, controllers no longer show any digital readout. I have a number of circuits running off the system and they were no longer powered.

Note that I am connected to regular power from the power company, so I tried to run a bypass while I wait for a technician to come next week. (Note: I made no other changes to the system because I'm not familiar with its operation.)
IMG_1473.jpeg
I found that by running the bypass, some of the circuits now work, but others still do not work. I tried cycling all of the circuits on and off but that did not resolve it either.

Any suggestions or hints on how to get all these circuits working under regular power?

raysun
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Re: Bypassing Solar

Post by raysun » Thu Aug 06, 2020 5:48 am

The picture looks like one of Outback's old DC disconnect panels. The wiring and circuit breakers are for the "DC side" of the system: Charge Controllers, DC input to the Inverter, ect.

Are the loads DC as well? Is there an inverter in the system powering AC circuits?

What type of circuits are not working?

kr8009
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Posts: 4
Joined: Sat Oct 29, 2016 6:39 am
My RE system: System installed around 2007

MX60 Charge Controller (x4)
FX series Inverter / Charger (x4)
Mate (x2)

Re: Bypassing Solar

Post by kr8009 » Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:17 am

Hi. Here is a picture of my system taken when it was functional.
ob system.png
Note that the DC disconnect panel I posted in my first post corresponds to the lower left in this picture.

The DC disconnect is connected to the two inverters on the bottom, neither of which has any status lights. And the corresponding controllers and mate are just blinking on and off.

I'm afraid I'm not familiar enough with the system to answer your other questions, but to clarify my earlier point about circuits, I've drawn red boxes around a few of the circuits that are not working even after I ran the bypass. For example, my entry way lights are not turning on, and they correspond to one of the rectangles. And there is an outlet attached directly to the DC disconnect panel, and it's not working either.
panel.jpeg
Bob

raysun
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Posts: 2801
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower One: FX3048T, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
Outback 200NC batteries (8 @ 48v)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
Suniva 330 watt panels (12 - 6 strings of 2 in series)
Hyundai 355 watt panels (6 - 3 strings of 2 in series)
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Bypassing Solar

Post by raysun » Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:30 am

OK. I couldn't read the labels in the first picture from my phone.

So those are AC circuits on the output side of the Inverter. All the AC circuits should have been wired into the bypass switch, but I'm guessing some were missed.

Without a wiring diagram of the system 'as built', it will be difficult to know exactly what going on.

kr8009
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Posts: 4
Joined: Sat Oct 29, 2016 6:39 am
My RE system: System installed around 2007

MX60 Charge Controller (x4)
FX series Inverter / Charger (x4)
Mate (x2)

Re: Bypassing Solar

Post by kr8009 » Thu Aug 06, 2020 9:29 am

Okay, thank you for your assistance.

JRHill
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Re: Bypassing Solar

Post by JRHill » Thu Aug 06, 2020 10:44 am

kr8009 wrote:
Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:42 am
Any suggestions or hints on how to get all these circuits working under regular power?
I bought a transfer switch this spring so I could bypass solar and go directly to the breaker panel from the generator. This should be a cake walk on a simple system, eh? No, it wasn't. I went back and forth from the OB manuals to my wiring and finally I got it. It took some number of sessions with time in between to come up with a schematic/wiring diagram on paper that was good and wouldn't destroy an otherwise functioning system. You probably need someone to back check what you are doing. Hint: it was the generator AC back feeding into the inverter AC out that was the challenge In the end it was a simple adjustment. But ya just can't have that mistake happen.

Best,
JR

pss
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Re: Bypassing Solar

Post by pss » Thu Aug 06, 2020 4:33 pm

eh?
Are we talking Canadian here? If so, I want my peameal please.

Mike Curran
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Re: Bypassing Solar

Post by Mike Curran » Thu Aug 06, 2020 7:06 pm

kr8009 wrote:
Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:17 am
Hi. Here is a picture of my system taken when it was functional.

Note that the DC disconnect panel I posted in my first post corresponds to the lower left in this picture.
Based on their position relative to the inverters, I believe the panels on the left are AC panels, and by the same logic, the DC panels are on the right.

Perhaps minor and not relevant to this discussion, but FWIW.
http://www.tigoenergy.com/site.php?95b2dca2-ca6c
https://enlighten.enphaseenergy.com/public/systems/Hctc107221

raysun
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Posts: 2801
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower One: FX3048T, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
Outback 200NC batteries (8 @ 48v)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
Suniva 330 watt panels (12 - 6 strings of 2 in series)
Hyundai 355 watt panels (6 - 3 strings of 2 in series)
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Bypassing Solar

Post by raysun » Thu Aug 06, 2020 9:06 pm

Mike Curran wrote:
Thu Aug 06, 2020 7:06 pm
kr8009 wrote:
Thu Aug 06, 2020 6:17 am
Hi. Here is a picture of my system taken when it was functional.

Note that the DC disconnect panel I posted in my first post corresponds to the lower left in this picture.
Based on their position relative to the inverters, I believe the panels on the left are AC panels, and by the same logic, the DC panels are on the right.

Perhaps minor and not relevant to this discussion, but FWIW.
It was the first thing that threw me. The panels were designated as DC, but obviously repurposed for the AC side.

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Re: Bypassing Solar

Post by sodamo » Thu Aug 06, 2020 9:30 pm

Trying to make sense of this, but with little luck. Almost looks like circuits are directly wired into the inverter circuit breakers rather than a distribution panel to the inverter bus bars? My guess is that lacking a wiring diagram, thecover needs to be pulled and everything traced.

I had the PS4 with 4 FX inverters. Other than the bypass, I had far less breakers.
Attachments
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David
Please visit http://vacation.ninolehawaii.com

raysun
Forum Emperor
Posts: 2801
Joined: Tue Jul 26, 2016 5:57 am
My RE system: Flexpower One: FX3048T, (2) FM80, MATE3s, FlexNetDC
Outback 200NC batteries (8 @ 48v)
Outback IBR3 battery enclosure
Suniva 330 watt panels (12 - 6 strings of 2 in series)
Hyundai 355 watt panels (6 - 3 strings of 2 in series)
Honda EU7000is gas fuel generator

Re: Bypassing Solar

Post by raysun » Thu Aug 06, 2020 10:18 pm

sodamo wrote:
Thu Aug 06, 2020 9:30 pm
Trying to make sense of this, but with little luck. Almost looks like circuits are directly wired into the inverter circuit breakers rather than a distribution panel to the inverter bus bars? My guess is that lacking a wiring diagram, thecover needs to be pulled and everything traced.

I had the PS4 with 4 FX inverters. Other than the bypass, I had far less breakers.
It appears from the labeling that the AC Out panels are actually used as the main house load panels.

There's one on the output of each Inverter pair, so a couple of 240V split phase load panels from the looks of the main disconnect breakers.

Unorthodox, but it must have passed inspection.

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